Kvetching About Fibromyalgia and Making Memories with NEW Doctors

Well, Yenta, I'm glad to hear you're getting out there and pushing the lines of the box you're coloring from related to health care!  I'd like to think that your seeing a couple of DCs in the past register and write on Lumigrate.com had something to do with that.  Last year the DC in New Jersey who co-founded with 'our' Mariluz Fontanez the International Fibromyalgia Awareness Campaign (IFAC), Mark Guariglia, contributed a piece and naturally we've seen the videos that Mari has done for their organization which focuses on his processes related to healing through DC as he is as she says, her 'wounded healer'.  For those from other countries, New Jersey is  up there near Yenta's beloved New York City, which she has referred to in many of her lovely posts here on Lumigrate.

Also, in the Grand Junction Grate Groove is Bryce Christianson, DC, who has written a bit in the forums as well. The LumiGRATE Groove is a group of providers I have been pulling together for the past year to start 'wearing a groove' by first learning of each other and from each other about fibromyalgia, then providing referrals to each other and outside the group as would be helpful for those with fibromyalgia (FMS) and chronic fatigue (CFS). 

Just yesterday we met for the third month in a row in this year of 2011 when I thought it critical to turn some of my focus to my community, as I hope to set an example for ALL communities related to education and awareness of providers about fibromyalgia.  I took in the PeaceFleece you made last holiday season and sent to me for using for FMS Awareness and FUNdraising potentially, in order to have it available to take a photograph of us having FUN with it.   For the first time in it's time traveling around it was used instead provide comfort to someone in the group who was having a rough day.  And I'm taking it with me today when I go to the doctor for a pretty badly injured toe.  I believe the beauty of it yesterday was, at the very least, a distraction with it's beautiful colors and I recalled the day it went to visit Dr Christianson at his office when I went in for an appointment.  So thank you again, Yenta, for the Peace Fleece and I wanted to let you know it was being put to good use and being as appreciated as your words. 

I thought it an interesting coincidence that a new user to Lumigrate registered and posted about his new Doctor and the good results related to shoulder pain -- it's raining chiropractic appreciation around here!  I am sure your words will help others in their exploration of alternatives or adjuncts to complement what they are already doing for their health care.  So you're saying we need to breathe and eat?  I think I have that part down!  

~~ Mardy

Addition in fall of 2011: At the time Yenta wrote this piece, I had seen something VERY interesting about a chiropractic-'created' program that was claiming to be very helpful to people with fibromyalgia and related chronic illnesses (in my mind, lupus, Parkinsons, and the dementias and many other things have a lot of overlapping effects and potentially causes; the treatments as a therapist are often the same or similar as well.  I contacted the group marketing it and found out they were working with a patient from Grand Junction who was going to need a provider to follow up once back in Grand Junction.  

Then this summer I was contacted by a local chiropractor who had been a speaker at the live 'Fibromyalgia Forum' I co-lead in years past, who said there was a new DC at his clinic who was certified in the technique I heard about when Yenta was writing this piece (put that provider / link she gives was for something totally unrelated it turns out.  Here is the link to the piece that the "new" local DC is bringing to the table for his clinic and sharing about here on Lumigrate.  

There are 'finder' listings with these websites when you link out to them and many have contacted me through the years saying they have found better providers and treatment through getting ideas and resources starting at Lumigrate.  

Here's the link ... I hope you take the time to follow and read, as I really liked the presentation I attended -- it just 'makes sense' from what I know and look for.  Again, it's for each person to become educated about and then form their own opinions and act on that.  (And naturally come back and tell us what you experienced or have an opinion about or 'know'! www.lumigrate.com/forum/nrct-™-potential-strategy-fibromyalgia-migraines-ms-ra-etc [4] )

Mardy dawlink, I've been going to Chiropractors since they were invented.  It's not so much that I believe everything functions through the spine but personally, I can't move comfortablly if my back hurts; so nu?  I have known, much like my doctor friends, that there are many functions of the body (leg movement, arms, head) that without the proper alignment of the spine kvetching isn't the only thing you'll be doing.

So I was talking with MY Chiropractor, Ellen goes to him too, and we discussed the Oxygen therapy.  Typical of a Chiropactor he is very open minded, however, a-typical, he has his reservations about it.  Even though I've presented the entire discussion to him he STILL has his doubts.  There will always be ney-sayers, bubelehs, you must do as you feel is correct for you.

Now if you'll excuse me liblings, I'm off to the Farmer's Market and Craft Fair in Ft. Pierce.  I'm meeting some friends there for a morning of memories, walking, kibbitzing and fun.  I'd rather buy from a local farmer than the local supermarket.  It's less expensive, better for my immune system and allergies (or so I'm told), and I get to sample all kinds of things for free - so who's going to argue?  Try it, it couldn't hurt.

Your

Yenta

Hi Yenta,

My name is Mona. I recently went to a pain managememt doctor here in Los Angeles. For my fibromyalgia, she recommended a Metagenics products called Fibroplex which is a powder, to be mixed in with high dose fish oil EPA-DHA liquid drops. She has these products on her own site which you have to buy from her. I'm sure she's making a profit off of it.

When I asked if I could buy these products in a health food store like Whole Foods for instance, she said NO. I find this kind of not kosher. Nu, what do you think?

I would love to know if you've done any research on these products.

Thanks so much dawlink,

Mona Prager

P.S. Just to inform the site, I wrote a previous post to you, and when I tried to insert a smiley face emotion, the post froze up, and I wasn't able to send it. It ended up in cyberspace. Sounds like a technical glitch. Oy, I hate computers sometimes when they give me tsuris!

Oy, Mona, that's all I have to say sometimes about websites. ("We got a garbled message from Cyberspace..., as she says, above.) Overall, Lumigrate has, for the past TWO YEARS now, had very few idiosyncrasies and is 'overall good' but that doesn't appease when something goes awry after time spent, so apologies and commiseration your way. 

From the beginning of Lumigrate, I'd included a link to Vitamin Cottage, which is shifting/rebranding to be known as Natural Grocers.  They're a Colorado-based company that started in 1955 not far from where I grew up, but I wasn't aware of them until after I graduated from college and moved back to Denver to do internships.  They're expanding to have stores in several states and are a wonderful store to go into and ask questions of the clerks on the floor.  They have an online ordering aspect to their website, but it doesn't have a good way for asking questions, that I can see (at least at the time I am writing this).  

So I worked really hard to bring other ethical and quality providers for Lumigrate's customers/guests/users to utilize related to the specifics of supplementing nutrition.  You'll see they're included at this post, below.  NEW at the time of this writing is a natural wellness pharmacy which compounds medications as well as provides many supplements.  They have customers across the entire US and ships all across the US (except there are some restrictions on shipping to California, so call and inquire with them if you reside in California and are interested in this type of product). 

It was really GRATE timing with this being our second anniversary at Lumigrate (3/27/09 was our 'go live' date) to have big news to bring up this week related to adding ITC Compounding and Natural Wellness Pharmacy to the content providers at Lumigrate.com! Also a Colorado-based company that I have met with for in total a day of in-person time after as many hours on the phone and even MORE hours with emails they patiently have cyphered through.  Because they are as scruntinous of who they get involved with as I am!  "We need to see the whites of your eyes first" Gary King, Co-President said. (Uh-oh, better hope my eyes are white that day, !) 

I joke, if you listen to the podcast of them which is now posted at Lumigrate (search on ITC from within Lumigrate, or go to the iTunes store and download it if you're a tech-savvy person), you'll see why that wasn't too intimidating as they are really very friendly, personable professionals. His other half professionally is Allan Jolly, also RPh and ND as well.  Podcasts are currently the very topmost forum if you click on Forums and you can listen on your computer via one link or go to iTunes on the other link I provide.

I hope that helps from the technical aspect, Mona and I'll ask Yenta to stop back by and let you know what she thinks as well. With any luck, Yenta'll give ITC a call -- they know who she is, they took a photo with the Peace Fleece she sent me this past holiday season to use with fibromyalgia awareness! (For that story, look in the Fibro Awareness Forum here at Lumigrate in the Fibromyalgia section, but for here, I'v included the photo, above, FYI)

~~ Mardy

PS -- I know this was lengthy, but I feel that supplementation and nutrition is one of THE MAJOR keys to wellness for all today, particularly those with chronic illnesses on the fibromyalgia spectrum.

It is true that you cannot buy Metagenics' products at mass market retailers like Whole Foods.  There's much to all the ins and out of the supplement industry that I've learned over the years, as well as Gary, and perhaps we can share more on Lumigrate about that at a future time when we have time to prepare that for your Lumigrate followers if they're interested.

We at ITC have always focused on the highest quality supplements at the very best price and to use the fewest products/supplements to get the best results.  For example, our UltraEssentials and Amino Mag gives the patient a complete multivitamin, trace minerals, antioxidants, fish oil, activated B vitamins (very important in fibromyalgia) and magnesium glycinate for about $1/day vs. just a magnesium supplement such as Fribroplex for almost $2 per day.

Links to our products portion of the ITC Website: For Ultra Essentials : itcpharmacy.com/store/cart.php [16]

and for Amino Mag www.itcpharmacy.com/store/cart.php [17]  

I enjoyed reading and learning about Yenta and her many skills. Also glad to get a better understanding about the Peace Fleece and that it was made by Yenta, as I had not understood that before.

ITC pharmacy is very excited about working with Lumigrate and we hope your readers are able to take advantage of ITC’s expertise in BHRT*, FM, CFIDS, including Allan’s expertise, especially in GUT health. I presume his response on this was helpful and naturally welcome your calls and further questions for us.  As Yenta says, It Can't Hurt! 

* Bioidentical Hormone Replacement Therapy, Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Immune Dysfunction Syndrome

Oy vey!  Who knew I'd be limed (subject of study - sotospeak).  Hello there Corporate bubelehs, how are you?  Your Yenta is farklemt (choked up) with pride at the moment but I wanted to thank you for the correction, Liblings.  It was my impression that most things are sold in stores or online, I didn't realize you had an exclusive with doctors.  Must be a good thing you make there, no?  So, tell me more.  Better yet, tell US more.  Are you picky as to what doctors get to carry your product?  Do I need to be careful of drug interactions (you never know)? Am I allowed to go out in the sun and do my gardening if I'm well enough, it hasn't rained in 24 hours, the elephants aren't wearing yellow polka dotted pajamas and the palm trees aren't turned upside down?  You can laugh at that one Liblings - It couldn't hurt!

Your

Yenta

ITC is a retailer which focuses sales to the public/consumer/'patient', not a wholesaler.  Providers could purchase from us but they pay the same price as a patient would. We're pharmacists who were used to dealing with the medical consumer so grew ITC in that direction and that's where our focus has remained. However, we do consulting with providers and appreciate opportunities to educate them as well as the public.  That's why we liked the format of Lumigrate which is working to educate both aspects of the health care equation.

I hope you give us a call if you have questions we might help you with -- find the information on our website, the link to which is in my signature area, below.

This is such an interesting coming together/back around experience for ME because two years ago Lumigrate had JUST 'gone live'/launched.  There currently are still videos on Lumigrate's videos tab from a local, Grand Junction MD, Scott Rollins, whose integrative medicine center became Lumigrate's home for our formative year.  All the other providers you see in video were also part of the formative year of the IMC and all also have gone on to other venues OR continued on in the ones they had as 'expansion to have a satellite' didn't play out at that time for them. It was a trying time to start a business as the 'great recession' occurred just after we got the roof over the head and the chairs in the door  Businesses are expensive and difficult enough in good times, so things did not go as planned for any of us I think. BUT we're ALL still here, just in different places! 

If you look back on my blogs from the first year I was attending seminars and reporting on them in the blogs, which was something the budding Lumigrate following read and followed.  "I wish I lived in Grand Junction" was the typical comment.  I'd always known that my back yard was the starting point for Lumigrate and since we'd set it up to go world-wide on the Internet (which you DO have control over by the way, some people thing 'Website means world-wide automatically'), the presumed the progression would be to expand to Front Range/Denver, Colorado providers and then national. For example, all my recording equipment went into lightweight plastic boxes; everything I purchased is small enough to load into a trailer which my 'puff tough' Toyota Highlander could pull to wherever I set up a studio next on the Front Range. That came in very handy on the day my friends helped me pull up roots and pack everything up to go into storage for what turned out to be 'the hibernation' phase with Lumigrate.  We had enough content that I alone could move things along and keep the budget to it's bottom line.  And for those of us who knew me a year ago I was at the bottom line.  But I'm still here!  In the same place!  I survived and thrived, learned and grew.  And we've had MUCH good come since that time in the form of NEW GROWTH, particularly in the supplementation of nutrition and hormones realm.

In 2009 when we launched, due to the wonders of facebook which had caught on with middle aged people in part with the 2008 Presidential election, Lumigrate was almostly instantly connected via the facebook fibromyalgia community getting behind a Chronic Pain Documentary Film Series kickoff event in California, so sooner than expected and bigger than expected, Lumigrate had providers, clinics and programs linking to it.  So it's really GRATE to, here in the week of our two year 'being up' birthday/anniversary, to actually 'be where I thought I was going to be' at the two year point -- which is working with ITC, which is in the Front Range.  I think from my Highlander, sans trailer of equipment as it's all packed up and just resting still, I could see the mountain I grew up 'on' from near their facility. I stayed with my best friend and her family while I met with ITC, as they happen to be in to horses and so live out in the direction of ITC in Castle Rock.  Ironically she had an industry conference in Junction last week and stayed with me, as their budgets with the economy weren't allowing for lodging expenses.  ("Our tax dollars at work", I had to joke or else I want to hit my head on the wall -- it's wastewater -- our budgets are so stretched they cannot pay for a PRESENTER about data management to teach at a continuing education conference?  I'm scared.  But happy she came to visit and had a place to stay.)

So 'in the beginning', I had been doing regular seminars via the Fibromyalgia Forum Dr Chris Young and I co-created in my previous conventional medicine building where I provided the OT services to a three story, all inclusive, medical group. Scott Rollins had been one of our guests, so that's how Dr Young and Dr Rollins became acquianted intially. Dr Rollins had investigated IMCs when he was working on whether to and how to start one here, and successful ones would host/present seminars. So there was going to be a large seminar area at the time I signed my lease -- unfortunately due to demand for other services they subdivided that into a small seminar area which didn't allow for an audience AND lights/cameras x2, my staff, etc, hence the two different looks of our videos -- we moved to a neighboring building and put in a little studio and I had some carefully selected audience members who would come for the tapings.  (Since the seminar area was essentially in the center of all the treatment rooms it couldn't be used except when none of the providers were seeing patients -- and we needed to tape at the same times and they were SO booked up and had so little time it had to literally be right on their way to work I felt.)  Picture dollars on a money tree just flying off into the breeze....

I'd attend every seminar the IMC put on, which took over half a year for them to get to fibromyalgia (Rollins) and Chronic Pain (Young), because they both do seminars in the allopathically-trained way, which is GRATE -- they stufy research, cite the research -- and these are people who see patients for about 50 hours a week at the least!  So those missed the timeline we had for producing video (which we hope to get back to someday soon but podcasts are proving more in demand), so what I did was have my talented employee and trainers focus on the seminars they did early on which had to do with people with fibromyalgia.     This actually did us a 'favor' and expanded Lumigrate to be about a broader scope of person/health, because we had detox and cleanse, food allergies/IgG, hypothyroidism, supplements, health management, chronic illness, health management -- a really powerful array of videos.  (All FREE now and easy to download, see the videos tab.)

One of those was supplements and disease prevention. (it's over an hour, very informative and $0.00! I suggest people ask their providers to watch it as well IF they are not seeming comfortable with their knowledge about supplements AND listen to the introductory and basics of supplementation and compounded hormones podcasts we have with ITC (we were approved so are on iTunes or at Lumigrate.com.  Forums.  Podcasts are in a forum currently and in the near future should move to being on their own tab -- every couple of years 'makeovers' are done on websites.) 

Dr Rollins' process was to study the Lyle Macwilliams 'bible' of supplements and select what he was to carry at his new IMC -- I know this becauue I attended his first seminars -- even when there was still drywall in stacks and we held it up front in what later became the reception area -- I think Walgreens rented chairs or something like that as at that time had at one store here with the only compounding pharmacy (they were buying up small successful pharmacies.  Junction's been their #1 producer too, even when they were up to over 500 in the US! Why? Someone doing seminars, good PR, and a community which all knows each other generally so you hear it from this and that person that two people you both know are doing something and like it, that means something!). 

This is where I learned about the book that everyone in the supplements business knows about, and so it has been listed since the launch of Lumigrate two years ago in the Products resources area OR on the supportive information that goes with the supplements video which you'll see if you cruise over to that and look. I never bought the book because having Lumigrate now, I look around to find someone who does and who has the expertise and focus about supplements and snuggle up to them to be my resource to call upon and purchase from related to supplements.  I've been at this supplements 'game' since before I got the diagnosis in the late 1990s, which is when I was also turned onto the HUGE benefit of taking a quality supplement which I referred to, above, in the discussion about Metagenics and Ethical Nutrients. 

Lumigrate also launched with a built in link to Vitamin Cottage but when I would be working 1:1 with a Lumigrate 'user' related to what to do about fibromyalgia, they'd want to hop online and order something and they needed advise about what to order.  All I can say is what I have taken, I don't advise other people as to what they should do because I'm an OT and that's not what OTs are qualified to do. 

So I kept searching for a resource to help with that and found it with not only ITC, but also Robin Thomas, who has been collaborating with and writing on Lumigrate back into 2010.  She's a tremendous supporter of Lumigrate and I've also ordered from her as I have ITC so that I can check them out and screen to be sure they're "LumiGRATE" -- and they ARE GRATE.  USANA and Douglas Labs are right at the top in the Lyle Macwilliams book. 

Now, I've heard some say that's not the universally accepted source in the supplements industry because of some suspicions of who was involved in putting the book together or something.  Again, this is where I just really work to find quality provider collaborators who are willing to venture along with putting in some time with Lumigrate as we make our way up the Internet foodchain. And not all who we trial continue on today -- sometimes we're not a fit for them and in some cases it's a decision on my part, and then it's whether to hold with the information on the website or to remove; I've done both in the last few months.

And sometimes, as what happened with Deirdre Rawlings in fall of 2010 and winter, she also was going up the foodchain and then had to put all her time into other projects for a while and is intending/planning to come BACK to Lumigrate and continue on.  In her case the cookbook she co-wrote to go along with Jacob Teitelbaum's FANTASTIC book Stop Sugar Addiction Now! could be purchased via ITC (as they currently carry/sell the initial book which inspired/demanded the cookbook.)

I intentionally held off on having Search Engine Optimization done because I didn't have the resources in place for the critical facets that a website about integrative medicine needs -- "Compounding Pharmacist" is now drawn into the You Model that will go into the upgrate of the website.  Nutrition adviser is also there.  (The You model we launched with two years ago had on it the IMCs then-provider types since we were attempting to collaborate on marketing at a local level initially for Lumigrate until we grew and wandered far and wide via Internet.

So in essence in the past fall and winter seasons I have transitioned to continuing to get some supplements when I shop for groceries at Vitamin Cottage/Natural Grocers (they're rebranding as they expand more into food), have ordered by phone and via the website at ITC Compounding and Natural Wellness Pharmacy, AND have used the lovely, kind, and competent Robin Thomas/USANA and I find them ALL good value for the money, high quality products, with various ranges of selection and ways of going about facilitating the purchase.  Robin gets a gold star on customer service, as she knew I was also exploring ITC's products and I'd not started taking the supplements I'd ordered from her yet so she held up my auto-ship at reorder time.  I believe in personally experiencing what I 'endorse and encourage' and she's an example of how the right people with the right MLM product to distribute can be an enhancement to the consumer palate. (And I feel proved me right to include MLM in the repertoir at Lumigrate.

I can't imagine ever not going to VC/NGs -- so I'm happy they are expanding to include such a wide variety of things that are in my daily health care eating/body/home care realm.  I've been their loyal customer since 1996 when all they had in their little store near Downtown Denver where I moved for internships at the Denver VA were supplements. But with my knowledge level at this time, if I'm asking a question and the people answering don't know as much as I do sometimes OR they cannot refer me to someone who does, I'm needing another resource. That's the downside of growth in my opinion -- they're reaching MORE people though, so that's AWESOME! Watch out Whole Foods! 

However, they're carrying brands to attempt to market to people who are used to buying supplements inexpensively at the grocery store, as they are becoming a grocery store essentially. And consumers will always push you to keep the prices at the level they're wanting to pay for something.  While they don't carry any brands that are downright 'bad for you', like calcium that has lead in it from using cheap sea shells from polluted waters essentially, sadly a real world example I have spotted in several houses I've been in over the last years since Lumigrate launched.  So by also now carrying some cheaper supplements, they're a GRATE SOURCE for people who chose to 'go cheap'.  And hopefully those people will start getting more savvy about what all goes into a product and the costs involved and continue, as I have, to utilize better and better products.

(By the way, these were without exception people who have plenty or tons of money, so it is a choice about how they are spending their money on themselves OR an education level 'thing'.   I'm likely not telling YOU anything, but sometimes people 'set themselves up to fail' in subconsious ways.  Or they can't think in terms of quality, only in terms of $.  It's really very interesting when you work as an OT with people how they proceed and all I try to do is make them aware and let them know it's up to them what they do, ultimately. 

"Less is more" when it comes to busy people or those who have trouble thinking, right?

So I find the expertise and customer service with ITC Pharmacy and with Robin Thomas outstanding.  Robin's background is as a scientist -- she's a 'standout' in the world of MLM and works with a tremendous company which I'm appreciating more now that I'm reading the new book The Healthy Home (see information soon at the Lumigrate bookshelf forum about it and in the forum on what goes into your home / work/ environment related to health).    I have chosen to include MLM when done appropriately and with high standards I expect at Lumigrate.com because MLM is 'everywhere' nowdays and there ARE good MLM companies.  I've done that with some risk to Lumigrate because of the eyeroll you get when "MLM" is brought up typically.  But in the tough economy and with the low cost to get into a business such as a MLM, it's flooded the US with people selling EVERYTHING!  I've even had Avon ladies at my door -- I didn't know they were even in business until 2 years ago when they seemed to come out of the woodwork and the stories were 'my husband was laid off so....'! 

... So I created a forum about 'how things are marketed' so we can have THAT as a resource for Lumigrate's users!  Robin's written something lovely there actually -- really inspiring and honest about her life and why she works from home in MLM and with USANA.  I hope that she and ITC and any other qualified people will contribute something in that section of Forums to explain more to us about how the commerce works in the various routes people can obtain supplements and other health related products.

Rememeber, I'm 'just a little Colorado mountain girl' that grew up to study but not graduate in business at Colorado State University, work in a now famous air quality research program doing program administration from those skills, and finally graduate with a BS and become an OTR in my mid 30s -- and simultaneously get fibromyalgia. 

Working in the medical industry at a hard time as I have, and persisting to rise to the top of the outpatient provider world in my western Colorado city in my mid 40s and sense the impending collapse of the old system of medicine.  I wanted to provide Lumigrate to ALL people, "Lighting the Path to Health and Well-Being".  And I'm so very proud of what I created which launched two years ago this week and to be saying this week how far we've come and have this outstanding repertoir of advisors when it comes to supplements.  And YENTA, that includes you, Bubbie!    Because you know what? (and I hope Mona is reading this too!)  I asked ITC's Allan Jolly (RPh and ND) the SAME QUESTION Mona did last week.  I left a VM for them and I was having enough trouble with my voice and new retainer in my mouth for moving my 'cranial vault' around to solve life-long breathing problems I only recently got the on and he'd emailed me to say he couldn't hear the # to call, but then we'd not caught up yet (we're both particularly busy so it's hard to connect sometimes).  SO I'd not yet gotten an answer!  So Mona's question got me the answer I was looking for and Allan can take getting back to me off his to do list.  TWO BIRDS, one stone.  Hopefully 100 or 1000 birds or more learn over time from that question/response.

Now I have my answer and am going to order what Allan suggested EXCEPT I just realized (duh) that the MalMag I was taking had a TON of B6 in it, and some of the Bs interfere with sleep and I take mag. at night.  I'm liking the USANA supplements way of breaking the minerals out separately so you can take those at night and the other things are in other capsules, but they streamline it a LOT and Robin's so helpful and knowledgeable for those who want a resource that route equally as commendable in my opinion.

It would take a lot of time studying on my part to be able to effectively take my supplement 'cocktail' or 'regimen' in the most effective way, and others who have this at the tip of their fingertips and tongues so I find source like them and request help from them, then do some business there.  Vote with your dollars these days.  I will plan to schedule some time to focus on that in the very near future.  I hope YOU do as well.  Remember, we have a whole section here in the Forums on nutrition and a forum there on supplementation ~~ Mardy

Gary dawlink,

Again thank you bubeleh.  Your Yenta enjoys a good correction as much as a good banter, believe you, me, Libling.  It's so nice to know there's someone out there looking out for our best health and not necessarily for their own wallet.  Of course, it's understood you should make gelt (money) but it should go without saying, no?

So tell me, dawlink, are you all over the country? I should be able to get you here in Florida and back in New York?  My Tanta (Aunt) Sara can get something of yours in California, while Cousin Mandy needs your help in Ohio (I have yet to understand why she would move there but it's none of my business). 

And by the way Gary, is the company on Facebook?  Are you Twitter?  Do you do that LinkedIn thing?  I have yet to learn how to operate some of them but I'll get there; Rubin, Ellen's son said he'll teach me.  Such a mench. If you haven't joined these networks yet my dawlinks, perhaps you should look into them.  Say it with me, It couldn't hurt!  Oy! I'm kvelling!

Your

Yenta

Yenta,
I learned a long time ago that I made more money taking care of my customers then I did trying to make money off of them. You are correct however that if I wasn’t good at making money I wouldn’t be in business and if I was not in business I would not be able to help all the people I have helped.

We currently have customer/patients in all 50 states but we do not ship prescriptions into California. If you want to spread the word among your followers about ITC we will make certain that like we do with all our patients that we take the best care we can to help them achieve optimal health. We may not always get them there but we will do our best.

What is a twitter and a LinkedIn? Just kidding! but since I am a grumpy old man and too busy working or golfing to sit in front of a computer or mobile device after I leave the pharmacy, I try to avoid the social network. You may find it hard to believe but I only have a regular old cell phone and once I get to the golf course or home I turn it off.

Gary

I think there's going to be a renaissance to the kind of lifestyle you embrace, Gary, so please don't feel like you're not the uncool kid in the class but perhaps the start of a new trend for those of us who would like to be as healthy as you are when we're the age of someone who might possibly be older and wiser.... ~~ Mardy

I'm blushing, Mardy   But I do appreciate the mention.  We have become GRATE friends ( as you would say)  Mardy knows that the most important thing when looking at our health is to do the very best thing for YOU!  And that is why we have choices in our life.   ( can you see I'm having fun with the graphics today) 

It's so nice to meet Gary and Allan here .  ITC sounds like a caring, quality business, and I'd love to learn more. 

Yes, I am a USANA associate, but I also use supplements with my family from other providers.  First of all, USANA only introduces new products after a very SLOW, CAREFUL process of researching through literature, careful consideration of raw material source, trial use at Sanoviv Holistic Clinic  www.sanoviv.com [31]  under the guidance of the physicians and healers there, and third party validation.  SO... they don't have the corner on everthing that is needed.  In my household we use Douglas Labs, Metagenics, Designs for Health, Systemic Formulas, and Perque products as well as USANA products. 

Most chiropractors and holistic wellness centers sell supplements out of their office for the convenience of their clients.  Now, there are always certain people in any business who are just out for the money... but that is not necessarily the case.  It can be very difficult to qualify an excellent supplement (one that meets both purity and potency excellence)  so it is best to buy from companies who know their business. 

Mardy has a lot of experience and she trusts ITC.  Therefore, I would trust ITC to provide excellent products. 

My family goes to three different chiropractors ( I go to one, my son goes to two- one in MN, one local)  They all have varied specialties and I trust them.  My son's chiropractors are more informed about supplements' quality and I trust them, so I trust the supplements they recommend.  

After 7 years, I trust the scientists at USANA to provide the highest quality of products they can manufacture.  I also trust NSF, ConsumerLabs, Lyle MacWilliam, and other third party certifications ( actually more than I trust the FDA, sadly)  Therefore, I trust the USANA supplements. 

It doesn't matter to me how the products are sold, whether they be in a store, at a pharmacy, mailorder, or MLM... what is important is the quality of the product! 

Unfortunately, it does take money to develop quality products... and it actually takes more money to transport and store in warehouses many products that are ultimately purchased at the big box stores than it does for either an independent pharmacy or direct mail order company, or even an MLM company.  So often, the "cheap" products from the big box stores have been marked up significantly.... even at their low price.... think about the quality of that supplement then....

I will stick with purchasing from my trusted sources.

and yes,  I like to tweet, blog, link, and FB  Does that make me "cool"  LOL!

You're and I have such respect for your not just about your son's health issues but being a proactive parent.  I've known that all along but didn't realize he goes to an out of state provider!  on the expense on travel for that but that kind of parenting.  Kudos!  SO glad you like to facebook so we met, Robin!  Thanks for your adding to the Kvetch.  (Was that right lingo, Yenta?  I bet she's going to wish there were a pill to give me to learn the lingo) ~~ Mardy

Likewise Robin it is great to meet you through Mardy’s Lumigrate site.

Allan and I feel that our success happens because, like you, we feel that the bottom line is helping patients and to do that we have to use high quality products. That includes both our compounded natural hormones and the supplements that we have researched over the years looking for both high quality and reasonable prices.

For those who read here because they have FM/CFIDS, these patients have often been sick for a long time before they find us and it can take some perseverence with time, quality supplements and often bio-identical hormone balancing to help them get better. That can become a fairly expensive situation so trying to get high quality for a reasonable price has always been one of our priorities.

Again, good to meet you and I hope we can speak in person on the phone or now they've got me using this Skype on occasion as well -- I see you're quite techy in your signature.  You'll see I've said I turn my cellular phone off when I get home or to the golf course, but I truly enjoy talking with people who are into supplements and eduation about these types of strategies for wellness and better health. 

Gary

Mardy dawlink,

Kvetching is an art but I'm going to tell you Libling you're a fast learner. Truth be told, to kvetch means to complain, i.e. "oy! my aching back" or "Would someone PLEASE turn on the air conditioner!" or "you call this a chicken? My father (G-d rest his soul) wore out shoes that had more meat on them than this!"  That my dawlinks, is kvetching - but you're catching on.  By the time the turn of the century rolls around you'll be speaking Yiddish like a pro.  Speaking of which, Gary dawlink - Florida golf courses are very nice this time of the year and they are starting to empty out now. The snow birds are flying home as Moisha and I will be doing soon as well.

Robin bubeleh, I'm so happy to hear that you go to a Chiropractor and so does your son.  Such wonderful people!  Ellen swears by hers and says if it were for him she wouldn't be able to do her job at the supermarket.  I believe it too, you should see what this woman does... Oy vey!  It would make your head spin, and spit pea soup!

I have to tell you though, at the moment I'm using up what I have in my cabinets as far as suppliments go. I know they're garbage (Sundown) but I had a coupon and it was easy to grab at the time.  So now that I know you boys things will be very different, no?

OK, no more kvetching.  Everybody take a deep breath.  I saw that Mardy... do it again... Gut (good), now blow it out and take your time about it.  Relax. Life is good my dawlinks, enjoy every moment.  Drink it in, dance in the wind and laugh in the rain (provided it's not lightening out of course).  It couldn't hurt!

Your

Yenta

We use the highest quality supplements for our patients, and as Mardy says “she can’t believe how fairly priced they are”. We have always strived to provide our patients with what they need and hopefully at a price they can afford because if the patient doesn’t take the supplements because they cannot afford them, then they will not be able to improve.

My Colorado “snow bird” golfing buddy is still in Florida enjoying your beautiful weather and said he would be back in Colorado by May 15th. He loves living in Florida half the year and Colorado half the year because he can play golf year around in beautiful weather by taking advantage of the best golf weather months that each state has.

Gary

I had to chuckle at Yenta about the coupon for some not so 'grate' supplements, I'd imagine.  (Though that is not my area of expertise to know the qualities of all of them on the market, I rely on people I encounter who ARE, and the bring them to you at Lumigrate.  If you look at Yenta's section ("It Can't Hurt, our Bubbie Yenta" is the title and it's located in the fibromaylgia section here in the forums), you'll see she had done a piece about "Coupon Therapy" and I am SO not a coupon person or one who buys something with a gimmick so I can get money back somehow ... it contributes to more paper, more things to remember and 'just not my thing'.  I look for deals at the quality places I shop -- I really 'vote with my dollar' increasingly, and try my best to stick to my personal ethics about who I do business with.  Naturally, that shifts with time.  Example: Recently I've tried to weigh transportation weight/costs to my formula and if there is a choice of a quality item that is a competitive/similar price that is produced closer to me, I go with that -- new to me in the last year.  Except seafood!   (I live in Colorado which is very 'landlocked'... )

So Saturday night after dinner, I had my box of stuff from ITC that had arrived in my car since one of my friends wanted to see what FOS was, as that was something recommended to me related to increasing gut health because I'd just had a round of antibiotics and clealry had yeast going if I got the sinus/lung thing ... my adrenals showed up as very fatigued in my testing and information/history I provided to Becca Slomiany, NP (who is under the roof of ITC for convenience and collaboration but her business is separate).  For example, their Multiple Vitamin Mineral, Antioxidant Formula from Ultra Genesis is $21.95 for 120 capsules and it's recommended to take 2/day, which is 60 days, so $11/month.  Previously/above, in the ? about Metagenics, Allan states the magnesium and etc product they would suggest that's comparable to 'Fibroplex' is $1/day which in my experience is 'a good price in supplement terms'.  It's kind of like knowing the conversion for dog years ... .

IF you want to watch Health Management video by Chris Young he talks about the advantage of being under one roof when it comes to the collaborative care model, which at the time of the filming was being used at the new IMC of Western Colorado.  It has a whole different batch of providers and services now which partly had to do with it being so very difficult to 'do' collaboration with many established professionals, from my perspective BUT the information in the video is really more about what ANY business can do if they're liberated from insurance billing/revenues/requirments (restrictions) and how the existing/historic model has created lack of communication between providers and the patient suffers for it -- getting the run around.  

I hope this string has given people a lot of information and ideas of who to turn to if they're needing assistance with something, including those who want to read something grandly fun from Yenta.  ~~ Mardy